Sex & Drug Trade: Shoudn't Govts Just Take Control-Pros/Cons?

[TSFantasia]

So the sex trade (prostitution, escorting, etc not sex slaves) and drug trafficking is a multi-billion (maybe trillion??) dollar international business.It makes criminal organizations rich and in a lot of cases more powerful and influential than the countries' govt,police, armies in the countries they operate from. Governments spend billions policing & fighting prostitution and drug trafficking. Shouldn't Governments just take control and legalize these things, regulate and profit from them??

Isn't this another case of "prohibition" that is repeatedly doomed to failure as supply is always based on demand and the demand is there? While there are the problems associated with addictions to these things but so are there to alcohol consumption, gambling, and smoking that the Gov't has long ago taken charge of and found them all to be "cash cows" inspite of the financial obligation to treat addictions and health issues that arise from these. The government already has to deal with the health and addictions treatment of those addicted to illegal drugs plus the billions spent for special police vice squads, drug enforcement agencies, prisons filled with drug related offenders all the while making no profit from the sale and distribution.

While even with legalization there will be some illegal activity but greatly diminished as why pay high costs and risk criminal offences for products that can be easily purchased at the appropriate outlets. As multi-national corporations will take over the production and sale and with product not being destroy or seized prices would be much more affordable to those who use it.

I'm not a drug user but just looking at things historically, economically, and practically makes sense to me. Of course the cons would be increased usage and addictions as people who would have never thought to try because it was illegal. I'm sure the same cons are for smoking, gambling, and alcohol sales.

[Shyla Wild]

After the Government completely fucked up the amendments to the Laws regarding prostitution, I think the answer is pretty obvious.

Bill C-36:
(a) create an offence that prohibits purchasing sexual services or communicating in any place for that purpose;
(b) create an offence that prohibits receiving a material benefit that derived from the commission of an offence referred to in paragraph (a);
(c) create an offence that prohibits the advertisement of sexual services offered for sale and to authorize the courts to order the seizure of materials containing such advertisements and their removal from the Internet;
(d) modernize the offence that prohibits the procurement of persons for the purpose of prostitution;
(e) create an offence that prohibits communicating ? for the purpose of selling sexual services ? in a public place, or in any place open to public view, that is or is next to a place where persons under the age of 18 can reasonably be expected to be present;
(f) ensure consistency between prostitution offences and the existing human trafficking offences; and
(g) specify that, for the purposes of certain offences, a weapon includes any thing used, designed to be use or intended for use in binding or tying up a person against their will.

Part A to C are a complete violation of the Canadian Charter of Rights Section 7: namely the right to life, liberty, and security of the person. These news laws, once again treat us like criminals. Could you imagine I applied the same laws to a Dentist or a Lawyer?

[TSFantasia]

After the Government completely fucked up the amendments to the Laws regarding prostitution, I think the answer is pretty obvious.



Part A to C are a complete violation of the Canadian Charter of Rights Section 7: namely the right to life, liberty, and security of the person. These news laws, once again treat us like criminals. Could you imagine I applied the same laws to a Dentist or a Lawyer?

Yes that's pretty fucked up and draconian if that's what they have come up with! But that
is still Government working with the prohibition mentality trying to punish both the providers and buyers of goods and services.

[Bacchus Boy]

So the sex trade (prostitution, escorting, etc not sex slaves) and drug trafficking is a multi-billion (maybe trillion??) dollar international business.It makes criminal organizations rich and in a lot of cases more powerful and influential than the countries' govt,police, armies in the countries they operate from. Governments spend billions policing & fighting prostitution and drug trafficking. Shouldn't Governments just take control and legalize these things, regulate and profit from them??

Isn't this another case of "prohibition" that is repeatedly doomed to failure as supply is always based on demand and the demand is there? While there are the problems associated with addictions to these things but so are there to alcohol consumption, gambling, and smoking that the Gov't has long ago taken charge of and found them all to be "cash cows" inspite of the financial obligation to treat addictions and health issues that arise from these. The government already has to deal with the health and addictions treatment of those addicted to illegal drugs plus the billions spent for special police vice squads, drug enforcement agencies, prisons filled with drug related offenders all the while making no profit from the sale and distribution.

While even with legalization there will be some illegal activity but greatly diminished as why pay high costs and risk criminal offences for products that can be easily purchased at the appropriate outlets. As multi-national corporations will take over the production and sale and with product not being destroy or seized prices would be much more affordable to those who use it.

I'm not a drug user but just looking at things historically, economically, and practically makes sense to me. Of course the cons would be increased usage and addictions as people who would have never thought to try because it was illegal. I'm sure the same cons are for smoking, gambling, and alcohol sales.

The illegal stuff would indeed then be hugely diminished and it would allow government and police to focus on the nasty stuff - hard drugs, child porn and true human trafficking. In addition the coffers would be filled - ask Colorado.

[Alexis]

C36 Is Very Bad!

Prostitution has never been illegal in Canada..

Mr Harper and bill C-36 are trying to change that..

After some of the current laws were struck down the Conservative Party came up with this bill..

It violates the rights of Canadians in general and will further put sex workers in harms way not help them..

It will make what we do illegal for the first time in the history of Canada..

While the population of Canada is 50-50 on the ideas in this bill you can be sure that the christian backed PC party and Mr Harper will push to pass c-36 at all costs..

Everyone needs to speak up and attend the protests against this bill!!!

This bill will drive escorting further underground and away from the protection of the law.. This bill will endanger lives, be the cause of rapes and murders as well as destroying the lives of the johns that get caught..

[greep]

What happened to the good ol' days when you girls would just upload cum shot videos.

[Alexis]

lol..

You can find those on my website..

Bill C-36 is going to make a considerable amount of the content on my site illegal..

If this stupid bill passes.. which it probably wont.. I might have to move my server over to the EU instead of leaving it with godaddy..

The bill will make any type of advertising illegal and will likely kill all backpage ads, SMC, TGF and all the places we advertise online or in print..

It would force many to working the street or clubs thereby breaking the law just to make ends meet and our criminalization, persecution and imprisonment..

Mr Harper's idea to the Supreme Court's request for better laws to protect sex workers is to make sex work completely illegal and drive it underground..

My Harpo & Mr Mackay are bible thumping fucknuts and will have the blood of women on their hands if this passes..
(that's a good one.. gonna have to use it on twitter)

Any of us who are willing to stand up for what's "just" need to speak out against those that try to oppress us..

C36 is a violation of Canadian civil rights, principles and ethics, it is a backward church based bill that has no place in the free, strong and vibrant society that defines Canada as a nation..

I just finished reading through the transcript of the second reading of this bill earlier today.. The conservative party is so fucked up it's not funny.. I'm really hoping this bill dies over the summer..

[xoxJanexox]

You can find those on my website..

Bill C-36 is going to make a considerable amount of the content on my site illegal..

If this stupid bill passes.. which it probably wont.. I might have to move my server over to the EU instead of leaving it with godaddy..

The bill will make any type of advertising illegal and will likely kill all backpage ads, SMC, TGF and all the places we advertise online or in print..

It would force many to working the street or clubs thereby breaking the law just to make ends meet and our criminalization, persecution and imprisonment..

Not any type of advertising. Only advertising for "sexual services". We will end up like girls in the states, where the ads are carefully drafted as companionship for money.

The new bill will decrease the variety for clients. Ads will be vague like the ones in the states.

[vancouverman]

Has Trudeau come out and said if he will repeal this stuff if he wins the next election, or at least re draft it to be more realistic? I get the sense this isn't a law he would support as it is drafted.

You can't prohibit vices. Gosh, we have so much evidence to support that. People will get their booze, drugs, or sex regardless of whatever enforcement the government puts out there. Why waste so much resources on it; I really don't get it.

Just imagine the wasted police time and court costs going after guys who just wanted to get a blowjob or something.

I wonder if local police forces will even bother to chase the guys down or surf the internet reading ads to see if it is illegal? My understanding is the VPD here seem to be quite open to the industry and work with providers and also with customers who get ripped off or assaulted. I wonder if they will actually enforce new laws like this or just turn a blind eye.

Religious people love to ignore real world evidence and don't kid yourself this comes from Harper's and his associates religious faith (the large volume of christians that support literal genesis decide to ignore every piece of evidence, science, math, physics, genetics, dna, and so on and so forth). It seems real world evidence that this attempt at prohibition will be a failure doesn't matter to them. DOGMA trumps practical ideas.

[Alexis]

Vpd & rcmp

Has Trudeau come out and said if he will repeal this stuff if he wins the next election, or at least re draft it to be more realistic? I get the sense this isn't a law he would support as it is drafted.

You can't prohibit vices. Gosh, we have so much evidence to support that. People will get their booze, drugs, or sex regardless of whatever enforcement the government puts out there. Why waste so much resources on it; I really don't get it.

Just imagine the wasted police time and court costs going after guys who just wanted to get a blowjob or something.

I wonder if local police forces will even bother to chase the guys down or surf the internet reading ads to see if it is illegal? My understanding is the VPD here seem to be quite open to the industry and work with providers and also with customers who get ripped off or assaulted. I wonder if they will actually enforce new laws like this or just turn a blind eye.

Religious people love to ignore real world evidence and don't kid yourself this comes from Harper's and his associates religious faith (the large volume of christians that support literal genesis decide to ignore every piece of evidence, science, math, physics, genetics, dna, and so on and so forth). It seems real world evidence that this attempt at prohibition will be a failure doesn't matter to them. DOGMA trumps practical ideas.

At the moment the VPD is interpreting the old laws as they see fit and at their discretion. The VPD has always tried to help working girls both street level and incall. They do not bust girls for soliciting and they do not bust the johns either.. unless of course you're truly causing a nuisance then they will.. VICE from the VPD is primarily concerned with hard drug trafficking and human trafficking which are both big problems here in Vancouver..

My personal experiences with both the RCMP and the Vancouver City Police Department have always been good. When I have needed help it was fast, it was cordial and never once was I talked down to or treated rudely.. The 3 times that I felt a need to contact them all involved threats on my personal safety with a firearm..

As for Bill C-36.. I think it will die if it isn't drastically changed as even the CPC is divided on it..

I'm pretty sure only a tiny minority of male politicians want prostitution made illegal.. The christian feminist ones want to burn us at the stake..

Now Mr Trudeau already has several contentious issues on his plate.. The Liberal party and the NDP both oppose this bill..

If you want to know more about this the link to the bill and the transcripts of the second parliament session on it is below..

https://openparliament.ca/bills/41-2/C-36/

[toban]

Beware of Politicians more than the Police!

At the moment the VPD is interpreting the old laws as they see fit and at their discretion. The VPD has always tried to help working girls both street level and incall. They do not bust girls for soliciting and they do not bust the johns either.. unless of course you're truly causing a nuisance then they will.. VICE from the VPD is primarily concerned with hard drug trafficking and human trafficking which are both big problems here in Vancouver..

My personal experiences with both the RCMP and the Vancouver City Police Department have always been good. > > > > > > > > >

I agree with this. Most police departments seem to let things be, only acting when there have been citizen complaints about something. Then they might introduce a sting operation or something similar just to assuage the citizenry. Look e.g. at the big brothels operating in downtown Toronto complete with newspaper advertisements. Brothels are definitely illegal but seemingly operate without any troubles.

I have a personal experience of being caught up in such a sting in Wpg. but thanks to the arresting officers my paperwork was somehow ?lost?, not appearing until after my court appearance thus causing a dismissal of the case by the judge, dropping of charges and my instant exit from court.

[GTanker]

Thanks for the link Alexis https://openparliament.ca/bills/41-2/C-36/

Not a big Harper Con fan, starting to gear up for the election now. I hate the fact the Cons write legislation that challenges/forces it's citizens to take them to court to get back the rights/privileges they take away based on their ideological beliefs.

It creates a divisive and adversarial environment that forces people to pick sides...a political strategy used by the US Republicans and embraced by the extreme Tea Party. You pick the right issues until you polarize enough electorate to win. It has nothing to do with the people and country's best interests, it's just all about a few people keeping power by enraging enough people against other people...for no good reason.

Elections used to be about Parties stating their intentions on issues, then you picked the party that reflected your position. There was actually intelligent, thought out policy statements. Both Libs and Cons used to do that very well.

I would much rather have a discussion base on facts and a solution based on compromise if there are conflicting facts. Not sure the Libs can do that now, but I am certain the Cons can't and won't with Harper.