Traveling girls - money mishap

[Rockheart]

Sunshine has mentioned it previously.

In general,
No one wants to be a prostitute if she/he has better chance in life. Neither do I.

Tgirls have less choice in life in order to be successful compared to normal people. So, unfortunately, escorting is one of the very few choice that we still have in order to survive.

By having this profession, we expose our lives to much bigger risks..being killed, raped, abused, harassed..not to mentioned of the risks of having STD and HIV. This is the first factor of determining our rate/donation

the second factor is our life span as an escort.
In general our escorting career is very short compared to those with "normal" profession. Only very few can survive and thrive more than 10 years.
In average, i would say, can survive only within 3 years.

As I have mentioned long time ago that:
"we almost like mushroom in rainy season and our era will be very short. Therefore we have to save up for the (better) future."

The third factor is Physical attributes.
as Sunshine, Lisa, and Tasha mentioned, it's not easy to maintain our good look. We need money in order to be sexy and beautiful.
The jewellery, clothes, lingeries, etc. these things are definitely crucial for a successful sensual encounter.
Ah..for me good food and wine too lol.

With all these factors involved, I personally believe that every professional provider should charge at least $200 an hour.

Of course some exceptions apply:
As Duke has also mentioned, he has predicted that some of us may earn mid to high 6 figures, charging $$$. I know one tgirl who charges $1.5K an hour . Or an upcale GG with 3K fee an hour.
That's true.
but those who earn that much is very very rare.

In general, as Lisa has honestly mentioned, earn less than 100K annually.
Some even earn less than 20K annually and have to rely on government support.

That is the reality.

So at the end, if somebody remember my old advice long time ago:
Do not rely on this profession.
This profession is only good for some time, but then we have to move on. Otherwise we will be left behind...

We have a lot of bad examples, showing that girls do not realize that their time is up, and still forcing themselves working as an escort and end it up dissapointed, jaded and angry.

However, we have a good example here:
Tasha who has gradually transformed her career into a better, much safer career as a nurse for her future.

Me too.
I'm a land lady and trader.

Well sometimes your time is never up, some people are lifers.
If you don't invest in your future when you are young, your options as you get older will decrease.
Fortunately the demand for tgirls has increase over the last number of years but unfortunately new players have entered the market.

The drop in price shows the elasticity in the market.
Since an increase in supply and an increase in demand lowers the price.
However it is possible the supply has increased faster than demand so the price has obviously dropped because of this.

The problem is the service provided is homogenius and not unique.
The type of service does not vary too much from provider to provider.
However the quality of the service can.
So those providing a higher qualtiy or "premium" service can realistically charge more than the market demands.

However to achieve this "premium" status you will have to provide exceptionally good service, be extremely attractive and/or hung, or be a famous porn star.

The increase in demand can cause the provider to try to achieve a longer shelf life than they may have in the past. In these cases many can go from being a "premium" product to only standard fare. Yet they still behave like the "premium" product they once were.
So what Tia says about the short shelf life being a reason for higher pay is relevant.
CEOs ask for huge salaries too since their average job life is 3.5 years and they are almost always fired. So not only is their tenures shorter than most workers, they may never get a job again in some cases.
(I will never buy the argument that TS have few options other than escorting. I don't think there is anything wrong with escorting, i just don't buy that particular argument)

Becoming jaded can be just as dangerous to an escort than age.
If you don't enjoy it, how do you expect the client to.

[Tia Phoenixx]

you have your points there Crag, but the problem is much more complicated than that.

I'm starving so i have to go to eat immediately.

Let's discuss this interesting topic later on.

[xploring]

OK I have been lurking and reading this thread for the last few days, and I finally decided to throw in my two cents. And believe me unlike the girls here I am ONLY worth two cents.

A few months ago I finally acted on my fantasies and had my first experience with a t-girl escort. As a result I realized the immense pleasure I received from my attraction to these beautiful women. I also came to the conclusion that given the relatively small number of them, I would probably have to use escorts to enjoy these experiences in the future.

(Can a transsexual and us guys who are attracted to them ever find true love in the big City? That is for another thread. See the discussion Paula started a couple of days ago http://tgirlforums.com/yabbse/showthread.php?t=103157)

In retrospect if that first experience had been with one of these low price sketchy girls I probably would have had a bad experience and decided I didn?t like it and never see another escort. Damn her for being so sexy, so sweet to a t-girl virgin, and allowing MSOG!!! It certainly would have saved me money over the last 12 months and into the future if she hadn?t been so great (but not cheap, it was in the US and cost $300 American).

I am one of those individuals who are willing to spend money to smoke the best cigars, to drink the best scotch, to have the best seat at the play or game, and to eat the best meals. The reality is since then I have found that all t-girl escorts are not created equal. And living in Alberta there really is not a price war going on here. And the price is up there, regardless of the girl. You rarely get the best of anything at a discount price. Therefore I have never negotiated a price for their services. However everything has a maximum and I will say they are at that maximum right now. And when I have had a bad experience it is over. I will never meet that girl again; too expensive to give them a do over.

Also Tia is right. They have a dangerous job. If you ask the escorts out there about conversations or emails we have had I almost always finish by saying stay safe. There are a lot of freaks out there (some of them are probably reading this thread) and I do worry about my friends coming across one of these nuts. You couldn?t pay me enough to regularly accept the risk these girls take every time they open the door.

If you view them as whores it is probably easier to justify in your mind that they should only be able to afford to survive if they supplement this work with another job. Why don?t we just add the stereotype that they are all strung out on crack just doing this just so they can get there next fix.

Due to the rise of religious fanatics from all the major religions, today?s society has taken on an extremely unenlightened view of escorts. In order to dehumanize them we have had to define the job as immoral and therefore the girls as little more than trash. In more civilized and sophisticated times it was recognized as a legitimate profession (Courtesans in France, Geishas in Japan , or escorts in India when they wrote the Kama Sutra). In those times the best ?escorts? did demand rates on par with the best in other professions. When we don?t attach the hypocritical religious morality, we can view the girls as people not objects. And like people in other professions some are bad, some are good, and some are the best and are rewarded accordingly.

So girls I have defended the fact that you charge hourly rates that are normally only reserved for professionals that literally are in the top less than 1% of their field. So now I am going to add to my tirade, my opinion on the other side of the coin. If you are really going to say, based upon your rate, that you are in the elite of your profession; you don?t get the privilege of having a bad day. If you say you are FF - you need to be able to get it up. If you have had a good day, and because of that can?t get hard make sure your date knows that BEFORE you meet him. Everybody reading this has been there temporarily at some time. (If you haven?t then I feel sorry for you that you have never had the experience of fucking yourself to exhaustion.) If he is a top he might not care. Or if he is a bottom he may want to say no I will see you next time. If you don?t have time because you are leaving town don?t take the date and spend 15 minutes. I guess what I am saying is be honest with us. You don?t get to complain about people feeling ripped off at your rates if you lie and treat your date merely like a bank machine.

I have had the pleasure of meeting some of the girls on this thread and on this board professionally and some others I would like to meet in the future. There are also some who I would like to simply enjoy spending time with for dinner or a game. But none of them would I ever suggest are worth less, when doing there job, than I am willing to spend on a good meal.

Now I have acted in a manner that if I was at my job would be among the dumbest things I could do. I have told my supplier that price doesn?t matter. So girls I am trusting that you wont look at this the next time we meet as a reason for price gouging. I am hoping you will act like professionals.

OK rant?s over.

[Rockheart]

Definitely the profession deserves a high pay scale simply due the higher danger and personal nature of the service

[sensual_lover20]

You girls are saying what needs to be said. Makeup, surgical or enhancement procedures, laser hair removal, electrolysis, some clothes, some shoes, hormones and other products to maintain your health (difficult while on hormones for most), doctor visits, etc. It adds up to an incredible sum. $39,000 a year does not even come close to being enough and these are just the real expenses of being a tgirl in earnest.

I don't drink, I don't take drugs, I don't spend alot of time partying. If I am to be honest, when I am working, I try to aim for $200,000 or better. Am I loaded with cash? No. Is most of it accounted for? Yes.

You are both confirming what it takes in your own words.

I still say lets start a union girls LOL.

Ahh enough about money already. Its too petty after a while isnt it. You guys offer what you can and I will charge what I feel is reasonable.

Sunshine

I agree with Crag's opinion of the situations. I will agree that $39, 000 is not enough for t-girls to live on. However, there is only some additional costs that t-girls have to g-girls which is quite costly (i.e. surgical enhancements). However, items such as make-up, apparel, accoutrements and even laser hair removal (as opposed to girls who shave) is a discretionary expense of your lifestyle. Then it comes down to whether you need surgical enhancements to really give that experience to a person, which shouldn't be the case but appears that it is the silicone which makes the girl the fantasy men desire. I think $78, 000 is reasonable given the risks of the situations and is calculated as follows: 2 men per day x 5 days a week x $150/hour x 52 weeks/year. This affords you the weekends off and personal attention to each customer given you only see two a day. In order for a normal tax payer to obtained the same salary they must make $169, 565 ($78, 000/46.1% top marginal tax rate). This salary is only given to very senior persons if they can attain it, but given this person enjoys being a sultry g-girl that engages in surgeries similar to that of a t-girl the after tax dollars appear to be fair to cover those expenses. High salary persons are subject to public scrutiny, long hours, strong intellectual years of experience, and pressures to increase revenues/improve productivity. Here I am comparing the reasonability of $150/hour, but would further like to do a sensitivity analysis of $100/hour (100/150 x $78, 000 = $52, 000 and $120/hour (120/150 x $78, 000 = $62, 400). Let's assume the average Canadian persons earns $60, 000 per year leaving them with $40, 000 after tax to play with. Assuming they have to pay rent, car payments and and food then they have little left over to play with to bear over $150/hour. Of course many make more than that, but unfortunately we cannot descriminate different rates to be charged to persons in higher tax brackets so averages must be used. Anyways, all girls have problems controlling their money, which is their own problem. Money makes the world go round (clearly can buy happiness in this case, but is subject to debate) and all most people care about is what remains in their pocket (not lint) at the end of the day. I think that a market rate is $100-150/hour is fair given my calculations and some qualitative explanations above. I welcome your opinion on the matter given that nothing truly is pure factual and an all encompassing case.

[Wiseone26]

I agree with Crag's opinion of the situations. I will agree that $39, 000 is not enough for t-girls to live on. However, there is only some additional costs that t-girls have to g-girls which is quite costly (i.e. surgical enhancements). However, items such as make-up, apparel, accoutrements and even laser hair removal (as opposed to girls who shave) is a discretionary expense of your lifestyle. Then it comes down to whether you need surgical enhancements to really give that experience to a person, which shouldn't be the case but appears that it is the silicone which makes the girl the fantasy men desire. I think $78, 000 is reasonable given the risks of the situations and is calculated as follows: 2 men per day x 5 days a week x $150/hour x 52 weeks/year. This affords you the weekends off and personal attention to each customer given you only see two a day. In order for a normal tax payer to obtained the same salary they must make $169, 565 ($78, 000/46.1% top marginal tax rate). This salary is only given to very senior persons if they can attain it, but given this person enjoys being a sultry g-girl that engages in surgeries similar to that of a t-girl the after tax dollars appear to be fair to cover those expenses. High salary persons are subject to public scrutiny, long hours, strong intellectual years of experience, and pressures to increase revenues/improve productivity. Here I am comparing the reasonability of $150/hour, but would further like to do a sensitivity analysis of $100/hour (100/150 x $78, 000 = $52, 000 and $120/hour (120/150 x $78, 000 = $62, 400). Let's assume the average Canadian persons earns $60, 000 per year leaving them with $40, 000 after tax to play with. Assuming they have to pay rent, car payments and and food then they have little left over to play with to bear over $150/hour. Of course many make more than that, but unfortunately we cannot descriminate different rates to be charged to persons in higher tax brackets so averages must be used. Anyways, all girls have problems controlling their money, which is their own problem. Money makes the world go round (clearly can buy happiness in this case, but is subject to debate) and all most people care about is what remains in their pocket (not lint) at the end of the day. I think that a market rate is $100-150/hour is fair given my calculations and some qualitative explanations above. I welcome your opinion on the matter given that nothing truly is pure factual and an all encompassing case.

Actually I'd freak out if I made $40k/year. LOL I won't say what I made last year but it isn't even close to half of that. I'm not whining or whoa is me, it's the reality why alot of girls escort. Thats where I understand thier choices and support why they do what they do.

The hourly rate is and always be a back and forth debate, but like was said there is supply and demand affects it. It's the competative nature of the beast. The level of service for the rate is also a much discussed topic but if you stick with the established girls that have good reviews you are going to getting what that rate is worth. BUT everyone does have a bad day now and again. So all this stuff will always be discussed. Girls need this much, guys only want to pay this much. The world unfortunately like sensual said revolves around money....and we get caught in the lure of that...boo on that! Coffee and a muffin at McD's $1.49?

oh and we are not allowed to use the icon anymore. oh wait I just used damnit!

[sensual_lover20]

Paula, thank you for reinforcing some of my statements. You are quite amazing for surviving on around $20, 000, but it proves that a t-girl can survive on that amount (escort or not) which supports a lower rate. It all depends on their personal lifestyle to how much income they must generate.

[Wiseone26]

Paula, thank you for reinforcing some of my statements. You are quite amazing for surviving on around $20, 000, but it proves that a t-girl can survive on that amount (escort or not) which supports a lower rate. It all depends on their personal lifestyle to how much income they must generate.

I'm not suggesting they can afford a lower rate. This is a lifestyle choice I've made due to circumstances in my life. I've grown to like a simple life. I pay a low amount for rent compare to what the girls due to have nice place for hosting clients. Like I said we can debate this till the end of the world. This is the nature of the business, because some people call it niche or fetish you are more then likely to pay more on the average.

[Justcurious34]

Greep you make an excellent point. This is a business and many factors contribute to setting rates. And there is a fluctuation as in any other business. And it is also true that there are far more tgirls now than there were.

This was an interesting post because it was a subject that can be difficult to approach sometimes. Thanks Rants for the idea. Lots of good ideas all around.

A final word from me (unless someone else says something good): It is perhaps unfair to point a finger at girls who drop their rates or charge low rates to begin with. There are factors that make this seem justified to them, I am sure.

Take care everybody

Sunshine

Sunshine
I really think most of you gals cry poor.
I have a hard time believing you would book two clients a day ,Im sure the phone rings off the hook. gal you are a quality woman.

class is not cheap,there is the best of the best, then the rest loll

LUCY's comments today about seeing dozens of clients in Montreal is more the real story

and thats great

I hope she is investing her money

to all I say

I believe that sex is one of the most beautiful, natural, wholesome things that money can buy.

duke

[sunshine]

the original point

Rantsalot started this thread by wondering aloud about the number of travelling tgirls. The thread has focused on how much girls charge and how much they should make per year, etc.

As was mentionned earlier, each locality is a separate market. Each locality has its own rate structure. I don't talk much about my early years but believe me, I have experienced many of the principle markets. This thread is an opportunity to talk honestly about the business. I am doing this to appeal to the girls to have solidarity in these hard times.

I was born in Africa but I grew up and got into this business in Montreal. Montreal is the worst market of all from a financial perspective. Rates range between $40 and $150 and I am being generous when I say $150. And at $150, a girl is lucky to see one client a day. Duke, you cannot believe everything you read on the forum. Girls want to be seen in a good light and talk things up on this forum. But this is the reality of Montreal. Although I haven't returned to Montreal, I am fairly sure that these hard times have not improved the situation.

I moved to Toronto when the business was hot. Toronto became the TS Capital of Canada. Rates were $250 to $450 and there were lots of clients, lots of money. That was then. Now in Toronto, rates have dropped to $50 to $150. maybe a girl can ask for more from time to time but clients and money are harder to find. Vancouver has followed the same pattern.

There are many other markets in Canada. A few of them have remained active and rates have stayed up. I mentionned that it was important for travelling girls to charge the going rate in the local market. Doing so will help preserve these markets. But girls are not doing this and the rates are dropping even further because of it.

As Rants asked about the number of girls travelling, yes there are more girls travelling. If a girls local market is drying up, what do you expect her to do? She must give it a try. To be honest, when times are good, a girl might travel to expand her exposure. But I doubt that this is the motivation for most tours now. Times are hard and a girl has to do what she must to survive. Duke, you are right about the phone ringing off the hook. But these are not clients. These are creeps playing on the phone or worse yet, other girls harrassing the competition in an effort to get them to leave. As far as clients go, it is touch and go. Sure if I drop my rates, I might be able to see a few more clients but I will not make more money.

I have done a couple of tours this year and I am now in Ottawa. Ottawa is another dying market. Some people ask if I will come to Montreal or Toronto. I might go to see friends or enjoy a night out but I will never go there to work.

Soon, I will return home and I will do what I can to help preserve the market there. I am also thinking about the future and am busy developping plans beyond all this.

From a clients perspective, this sure seems like a buyer's market. With rates this low, they seem to be in a good situation. But there will be a weeding out process as many girls simply cannot continue to remain active. Things will change.

So to answer Rants, times are hard and the economy is not back to normal yet as far as I can see.

Sorry about the long post

Sunshine

[Justcurious34]

Rantsalot started this thread by wondering aloud about the number of travelling tgirls. The thread has focused on how much girls charge and how much they should make per year, etc.

As was mentionned earlier, each locality is a separate market. Each locality has its own rate structure. I don't talk much about my early years but believe me, I have experienced many of the principle markets. This thread is an opportunity to talk honestly about the business. I am doing this to appeal to the girls to have solidarity in these hard times.

I was born in Africa but I grew up and got into this business in Montreal. Montreal is the worst market of all from a financial perspective. Rates range between $40 and $150 and I am being generous when I say $150. And at $150, a girl is lucky to see one client a day. Duke, you cannot believe everything you read on the forum. Girls want to be seen in a good light and talk things up on this forum. But this is the reality of Montreal. Although I haven't returned to Montreal, I am fairly sure that these hard times have not improved the situation.

I moved to Toronto when the business was hot. Toronto became the TS Capital of Canada. Rates were $250 to $450 and there were lots of clients, lots of money. That was then. Now in Toronto, rates have dropped to $50 to $150. maybe a girl can ask for more from time to time but clients and money are harder to find. Vancouver has followed the same pattern.

There are many other markets in Canada. A few of them have remained active and rates have stayed up. I mentionned that it was important for travelling girls to charge the going rate in the local market. Doing so will help preserve these markets. But girls are not doing this and the rates are dropping even further because of it.

As Rants asked about the number of girls travelling, yes there are more girls travelling. If a girls local market is drying up, what do you expect her to do? She must give it a try. To be honest, when times are good, a girl might travel to expand her exposure. But I doubt that this is the motivation for most tours now. Times are hard and a girl has to do what she must to survive. Duke, you are right about the phone ringing off the hook. But these are not clients. These are creeps playing on the phone or worse yet, other girls harrassing the competition in an effort to get them to leave. As far as clients go, it is touch and go. Sure if I drop my rates, I might be able to see a few more clients but I will not make more money.

I have done a couple of tours this year and I am now in Ottawa. Ottawa is another dying market. Some people ask if I will come to Montreal or Toronto. I might go to see friends or enjoy a night out but I will never go there to work.

Soon, I will return home and I will do what I can to help preserve the market there. I am also thinking about the future and am busy developping plans beyond all this.

From a clients perspective, this sure seems like a buyer's market. With rates this low, they seem to be in a good situation. But there will be a weeding out process as many girls simply cannot continue to remain active. Things will change.

So to answer Rants, times are hard and the economy is not back to normal yet as far as I can see.

Sorry about the long post

Sunshine

I for one really appreciate your honest ,it will not change my thoughts on meeting the different ladies,but Im on a different mission and will continue to pay what ever they ask. but as most of the people who are on this site may know ,Im not into just sex far from it. My mainy goal is information about their life and background and maybe if time some sex, but Im not into cover BJs and that all I would have interest in.

Sunshine ,I would really like to know more about you Im sure you could fill a book with your travel and experience
Thank you for being you
You truly are a touch of class
I wish you will
duke
but just from my limited experience, there are gals out there making a lot of cash through travel

[bangkokcake]

same not easy

[deuxglass]

Just one thing is true

You get what you pay for. If she is happy she will make you happy too. There are two types of clients. The first wants a "good deal" and the second wants a good time and is willing to go the extra mile. It must be hard for you girls to judge beforehand. I guess the best way is to develop a steady and loyal clientele of men who appreciate you and whom you appreciate. I am in sales and the best clients become friends.
That's my two cents worth.

[pensive]

Well, this is the part where I eat crow. I said in an earlier post that I wouldn't pay $250 ever again because I didn't feel it was worth it, but I just had to give Lola a try. She completely rocked my world, and instinctively pushed all of my right buttons. She was worth it. I just wish I could afford it every week

[Tia Phoenixx]

oh..i just re-read again this thread.

It's definitely interesting