Shooting kids.....

[corbindallas]

The problem is that these kids don't get mental help, they get pharmaceutical drugs.
The shrinks tell them what is wrong with them, rather than work through their real problems.

Their parents are more worried about themselves than taking care of their kids.
Drug the kids and problem goes away.
Mothers can pursue their careers without the hassle of children.
Fathers cannot use discipline or the threat of it, so drugging the kids works.
Throw easy access to guns in the mix and you have tragedy.

So you have drugged up kids with artificial complexes planted in their brains and no parents that care.
Who the hell said having a career is more important than being a mother, it is not!
Many women have a false idea of what life is all about, if you want a family then have one.
This modern family hybrid is bullshit.

Think about it.
Kids don't need drugs, they need LOVE.

Wow! So many questions... Like much of what you have said is complete garbage and needs clarification. What do you mean when you say fathers cannot use discipline? And what is the THREAT of discipline exactly? Sounds like it involves fear mongering your children, which is more than likely the actual cause of alienation in young children. And how do women have a false idea of what life is about?

Maybe I can even save you the time in answering by surmising 1. that you are out of touch and 2. that you hold the same opinions of women as people from the bronze age.

[Shyla Wild]

Wow! So many questions... Like much of what you have said is complete garbage and needs clarification. What do you mean when you say fathers cannot use discipline? And what is the THREAT of discipline exactly? Sounds like it involves fear mongering your children, which is more than likely the actual cause of alienation in young children. And how do women have a false idea of what life is about?

Maybe I can even save you the time in answering by surmising 1. that you are out of touch and 2. that you hold the same opinions of women as people from the bronze age.

Seems like you are the one out of touch. The growing cost of living has also forced mothers into the workplace. The effect means more children in daycare. Daycare is not parenting. And even if it was, individual attention of a mother is far better than the group atmosphere of daycare. Does the Prince go to class or does he receive private tutors? Hence, one on one learning is best.

Here is a article written by Lois Wladis Hoffman PhD in Psychology at the University of Michigan-Ann Arbour. It should help you get in touch.
http://parenthood.library.wisc.edu/Hoffman/Hoffman.html

[corbindallas]

Seems like you are the one out of touch. The growing cost of living has also forced mothers into the workplace. The effect means more children in daycare. Daycare is not parenting. And even if it was, individual attention of a mother is far better than the group atmosphere of daycare. Does the Prince go to class or does he receive private tutors? Hence, one on one learning is best.

Here is a article written by Lois Wladis Hoffman PhD in Psychology at the University of Michigan-Ann Arbour. It should help you get in touch.
http://parenthood.library.wisc.edu/Hoffman/Hoffman.html

I would agree if you wouldn't keep insisting on the mother having to do such things as if it is an end all solution. You act as though a woman's true place is in the home and the cost of living has driven her out of her true domain. That's sexism. Maybe she wants to work, have a life and interests of her own. Maybe she simply wants to do her part in society without people judging her as a mother. A woman's role isn't, by default, to be in the home. I'm surprised I'm meeting such discordance on this matter.

Parents need to care for and raise their children, yes. I wouldn't bother debating that. But this constant attention given to women needing to mother, stay at home and be care givers is BS. And the subsequent drawing attention to their entering the work force as somehow being a reason for blame for all this has a sexist pretext. Day cares could be better for sure. They are expensive and children do not always get one on one attention. Day cares (in France I believe?) are free of cost and provided by the government. I'm a big believer that such things should be provided for so it's no simple fix in my mind. But children also need time in the day to be away from parents. Why are people so hingent upon children and adolescents needing 24 hour interaction with their parents? This is also not healthy. I believe it is healthy that for part of the day the kid gets time to do other activities; spending time with others his or her own age for example. I wouldn't be against longer paternity and maternity leaves. Other countries seem to be much more liberal than the US when it comes to things like this but I digress.

So, though you are quick to throw research at me done on day care it was never the argument I had to begin with.

[Shyla Wild]

I would agree if you wouldn't keep insisting on the mother having to do such things as if it is an end all solution. You act as though a woman's true place is in the home and the cost of living has driven her out of her true domain. That's sexism. Maybe she wants to work, have a life and interests of her own. Maybe she simply wants to do her part in society without people judging her as a mother. A woman's role isn't, by default, to be in the home. I'm surprised I'm meeting such discordance on this matter.

So, though you are quick to throw research at me done on day care it was never the argument I had to begin with.

The problem was you did not open the link. The title of the research was The Effects of the Mother's Employment on the Family and the Child.

If you are so blinded by sexism then let the father stay home. The issue was not sexism, but the LACK of parental influence on a child's upbringing. You do not understand why people are so hinged on 24hr supervision of children? Simple...anyone under the age of 18 is a child and when kids fuck up what do we all say? WHERE WERE THE PARENTS?

In the end, we can all argue how to fix the problem. But the truth is...the US does not want to fix the problem. Why? The video below is full of very interesting information and if you have 2hrs I would recommend watching the entire thing, but the part I want to draw attention to 43:20. Just watch that section. That will explain everything.

[wantitss63]

[QUOTE=Shyla Wild;389120]The issue was not sexism, but the LACK of parental influence on a child's upbringing. You do not understand why people are so hinged on 24hr supervision of children? Simple...anyone under the age of 18 is a child and when kids fuck up what do we all say? WHERE WERE THE PARENTS?
QUOTE]

Bingo! Agreed, without reservation. The 2 kids (I'm not gonna mention their names, because they were intent on being remembered - so the best I can do is refuse to acknowledge them) that perpetrated Columbine made pipe bombs in their parent's houses, they spent hours upon hours on the Web researching the best ways to kill as many people as possible. The parents were entirely absent, too busy chasing the American dream..

I read today on CNN that all the weapons used in Newtown were owned by the killer's mother - apparently (at least per the report), everyone knew the kid was a little 'off', so teaching the use of semi-automatic weapons at the range seemed like a great way to bring him out of his shell.... WTF?!?! Mindblowing.......

BTW: that WAS an interesting video - makes me wonder just how much of that information applies here, north of the border.......

[Shyla Wild]

BTW: that WAS an interesting video - makes me wonder just how much of that information applies here, north of the border.......

You would have to watch the whole video. There is a lot of information presented. Due to certain factors and US Laws, not as much applies to us. But without a doubt a very alarming video, explaining (with documentation) many factors of the US Government. Micheal Moore released Fahrenheit 911 but this lecture by Mike Ruppert is even more detailed.

[LOLA_]

I am so sad for those kids , almost 100 shots and many death kids I am sorry for kids and their families, I think US needs to make it better place, US need to change two things

1 NO ONE allow to carry a gun or any weapon
2 Every one should use free health care !!..

[wantitss63]

I am so sad for those kids , almost 100 shots and many death kids I am sorry for kids and their families, I think US needs to make it better place, US need to change two things

1 NO ONE allow to carry a gun or any weapon
2 Every one should use free health care !!..

The US is a country full of contrasts - they put a man on the moon, but don't have universal health care; they are the 'Land of the Free', but incarcerate more than anyone else (I think - certainly among industrialized nations); they are the 'home of the brave', but those who can afford it live in gated (and guarded) communities behind high walls. So many ironies. When motivated, no other country can match their innovation, their drive.....but they are so A.D.D. these days.

Still, I'm glad 'their' system won the Cold War........ My Russian is pretty much non-existent. Da, Tovarisch?

[wantitss63]

I am so sad for those kids , almost 100 shots and many death kids I am sorry for kids and their families, I think US needs to make it better place, US need to change two things

1 NO ONE allow to carry a gun or any weapon
2 Every one should use free health care !!..

Well according to the news outlets, there are calls for 'meaningful reform' on gun control in the US - coming from 2 senators (among others) who have previously been anti-gun control. Maybe there is a sliver of hope that some good will come of this. Fingers crossed.......

[Shyla Wild]

Well according to the news outlets, there are calls for 'meaningful reform' on gun control in the US - coming from 2 senators (among others) who have previously been anti-gun control. Maybe there is a sliver of hope that some good will come of this. Fingers crossed.......

The US is a country that defends the right to bear arms....yet invaded Iraq on the grounds that they may possess weapons and is freaking over North Korea arming themselves. Large double standard.

I hope some good can come out of this mess. It's just before Christmas and the Holidays and lives are ruined. Presents have been bought that will never be opened. Parents are going to wonder what their child did to deserve this...and I wonder how the parents and loved ones of these children have the strength to move forward. Christmas will forever haunt these people and that is the reality of this. I feel utmost sorrow for those parents as no parent should ever bury their child.

[wantitss63]

I feel utmost sorrow for those parents as no parent should ever bury their child.

That's the essence of it - I can imagine nothing more crushing. Add to that the fact that the child's death was a deliberate act; on top of that think of the time of year. It must be unimaginably bleak for those parents and loved ones. Literally EVERYTHING they have regarded as stable, as solid has been torn away.

How to even think about picking up the pieces? God knows.......maybe

[Raging Bob]

My $0.02

The worst part of this whole thing, obviously, is the loss of so many innocent young lives....completely senseless.

This is one of the few cases where I have any sympathy for the shooter, not that I wouldn't prefer he be shot in the head instead of those kids, but he had autism and other issues that weren't being properly dealt with by his mother. Also she apparently had just informed him that he was going into an institution.

He was armed to the teeth, as I understand all the weapons he had belonged to his mother. He also had an abundance of ammo, also, thanks to his mother. The ammo had to be bought at different stores in different states so she went to a lot of trouble to get it.

If she wasn't his first victim, maybe she could have explained why she had a need for the weapons she had in the house. I get the feeling that one person made a lot of bad decisions and everyone ended up paying the price!

I know it's just 20/20 hindsight at this point, but maybe someone can learn something and maybe catch a warning sign.

[Shyla Wild]

If she wasn't his first victim, maybe she could have explained why she had a need for the weapons she had in the house. I get the feeling that one person made a lot of bad decisions and everyone ended up paying the price!.

Here is the reason:
The Second Amendment (Amendment II) to the United States Constitution is the part of the United States Bill of Rights that protects the right of the people to keep and bear arms. It was adopted on December 15, 1791, along with the rest of the Bill of Rights.

[wantitss63]

Here is the reason:
The Second Amendment (Amendment II) to the United States Constitution is the part of the United States Bill of Rights that protects the right of the people to keep and bear arms. It was adopted on December 15, 1791, along with the rest of the Bill of Rights.

Hmmmm....maybe laws still on the books from the late 18th century should be revisited? Just throwing it out there.......... After all, we now longer allow slavery, women get to vote these days (well, in most places), I don't think duelling is legal, and so on..... Crazy thinking, huh?

[corbindallas]

Simple...anyone under the age of 18 is a child and when kids fuck up what do we all say? WHERE WERE THE PARENTS?

I know that's what you and many others say. I'm asking why that's your instant reaction when there's clearly many other factors to consider? Why do people continually ask WHERE WERE THE PARENTS? when we know for a fact that countless other individuals and institutions affect a person's development? The average kid will spend a third of the their time in school, a third to sleep if theyre lucky and the rest is divided between friends and parents (I should note how friends here can receive a majority of the time considering time in and out of school). You seem to assume that lack of parental presence is the issue, when its obvious that we should be asking what ALL of one's influences are and how effective each one is. Teens, for example, often can't be bothered by their parents. I know this because I was a teen and never gave a damn about hanging out with my parents. And of course I wouldn't want to, that would have made me look "lame" or something to that effect. Plus I was interested in girls and hanging out with friends. Kids value time with peers. I would argue They're much more influenced by time in school and with friends at certain ages. Hence why bullying in school has such profound effects on kids.

I don't doubt your passion on the subject. Nor am I defending shitty parenting. It's just plainly obvious how stupid it is to put all the blame on a parent when a person does something wrong and subsequently berating said parent with WHERE WERE YOU!? HOW COULD YOU LET THIS HAPPEN!? At a certain point one has to be accountable for their own actions. Obviously this depends on age and maturity. You make it seem, though, as though the only reason people do bad things is because of upbringing. Biology, in many instances, can be shown to be a stronger predictor of behavior than one's experiences. One could theorize, even, that some mass shooters are biological predisposed to commit their acts. It's not as simple as WHERE WERE THE PARENTS?

Also, to address your initial post, mass shootings are not on the rise. So I wouldn't say the world is getting any crazier. There is actually a piece of research I read recently about how this type of stuff has happened since the dawn weapons. Guns contribute to body count, so I'm advocating against them. But, let it be known, these things will continue to happen like statistical blips across the evolution of society unless we rid ourselves of these tools. There will always be people who are "misunderstood"; always those who need to prove some sadistic point to society. But, as I said, such issues are not exclusively determined by parenting. In fact, we know considerably little on this subject. I would say the best solution is gun control. Most of these people who commit these crimes are trained in the use of weapons and are desensitized to killing -- in such a way that killing is seen as problem solving behavior. Get rid of the guns, then the positive representation of them in mass society has no effect.