Orlando Massacre Shooter: Terrorist? Homophobe? Self-loathing Closeted Gay?

[Mouthwideopen]

On on another relevant matter: I write in a concise style for various reasons. Perhaps the nuance and intended meaning is not conveyed. My apologies.
HOWEVER:
By affixing derogatory labels to people rather than asking for clarity, as He Whose Handle Was So Appropriately Chosen has done, only defines them and certainly does not advance the dialogue in this discussion.

Well stupid me; here I foolishly assumed that when you typed the words;

I have been following this discussion and one about the City of Toronto ad concerning racism on another forum. I'm appalled at the amount of hate, racism, and misinformation spewing forth from our fellow citizens.

, that you had meant you were appalled at hatred and racism in this thread. I guess somehow I must have misunderstood your concise non-cryptic message and if not then pls be a dear and point out which post # where the hatred and racism can be found? Thanks.


In the meantime;

https://www.thestar.com/news/world/2...officials.html

I can't believe the hated and racism found in this article. How dare they pretend to know who orchestrated this attack. Shocking. Hasn't Turkey banned bombs yet? They really should you know. We shouldn't focus on who actually did this horrendous act or what may have motivated them..... no no... that would be foolish.

As soon as I heard the news I was already assuming - making an ass of myself - as to who could be responsible....

[Shyla Wild]

Start watching at 1:23....I think sums up everything about these situations. But the whole thing is good.

[Mouthwideopen]

So that's it? We just chalk everything up to "crazy"? I'll be first to agree that there will always be crazies and violence and war... but should we not do something about the motivations behind the crazy?

Btw; that skit immediately reminded me of this one;

Thank the mighty sky monsters that there's no tigers reading religious texts yet!

[unchained1]

Well stupid me; here I foolishly assumed that when you typed the words;

, that you had meant you were appalled at hatred and racism in this thread. I guess somehow I must have misunderstood your concise non-cryptic message and if not then pls be a dear and point out which post # where the hatred and racism can be found? Thanks.


In the meantime;

https://www.thestar.com/news/world/2...officials.html

I can't believe the hated and racism found in this article. How dare they pretend to know who orchestrated this attack. Shocking. Hasn't Turkey banned bombs yet? They really should you know. We shouldn't focus on who actually did this horrendous act or what may have motivated them..... no no... that would be foolish.

As soon as I heard the news I was already assuming - making an ass of myself - as to who could be responsible....


[ATTACH=CONFIG]132834[/ATTACH]

I did note that I was reading another forum as well. In comparison, to ease your fear that I have been attacking you, this one has been mild and has kept on topic more or less. The other one dredged up every stereotype of every race,culture,religion,ethnicity imaginable in quite vitriolic terms. I am no apologist if that is what you think. All of these acts are reprehensible.
Each response feeds the next cycle of violence. I don't have the answer and I don't think you do either. Blaming the religion and all of it's adherents for the acts of the radicals gains us nothing.
Mayor Nenshi of Calgary and Mullah Omar may share the same religion,but their ideologies are galaxies apart.

[TSFantasia]

So that's it? We just chalk everything up to "crazy"? I'll be first to agree that there will always be crazies and violence and war... but should we not do something about the motivations behind the crazy?

Btw; that skit immediately reminded me of this one;

Thank the mighty sky monsters that there's no tigers reading religious texts yet!

I agree this cannot be dismissed as "crazies" or a few religious extremists within the Muslim community this is a very organized worldwide attack by the "jihadists" of the Muslim world , which represents a large portion of the Muslim world that are likely to sympathize, join , or support this ideology as a logical outcome of their beliefs.

Western nations need to protect themselves and their civilians from these attacks that are fuelled and motivated by jihadist ideologies. Yes it means some will feel singled out as the highest probability group ie young Muslim men that have showed any signs of aggressive behavior or speech towards "western democracies". Those who express sympathy toward the jihadist cause by being on sites or forums that are supportive or sympathetic to those views. The scaling back of any and scutinizing of any Muslim refugees coming from these countries.

We are at war whether we like it or not!

[Alexis]

I agree this cannot be dismissed as "crazies" or a few religious extremists within the Muslim community this is a very organized worldwide attack by the "jihadists" of the Muslim world , which represents a large portion of the Muslim world that are likely to sympathize, join , or support this ideology as a logical outcome of their beliefs.

Western nations need to protect themselves and their civilians from these attacks that are fuelled and motivated by jihadist ideologies. Yes it means some will feel singled out as the highest probability group ie young Muslim men that have showed any signs of aggressive behavior or speech towards "western democracies". Those who express sympathy toward the jihadist cause by being on sites or forums that are supportive or sympathetic to those views. The scaling back of any and scutinizing of any Muslim refugees coming from these countries.

We are at war whether we like it or not!

I'd have to disagree.. this guy was clearly mentally disturbed.. no sane individual would do this..

How did he become like that? Well that might be because of Wahhabiism.. and bad parenting..

The fact is that most of the attacks and mass shootings in north America are lone wolf crazies..

The Jihadists don't seem to be organized at all really.. that or they're just really stupid..

As for democracy.. do you really believe that even exists in the USA? Seriously?? It's a corrupted fascist oligarchy run by fake money..

I don't sympathize with the 2nd and 3rd world people using terror attacks against the west.. but I do see how through 2 centuries of oppression the west has made more than a few enemies.. People and cultures hold grudges for a long time..

Right now there are 10,000's of people dying every year in North America from illegal Chinese made pharmaceuticals.. Yet the USA & the west would rather fight it's war of terror so it can secure all the oil possible.. They sell the war to us on every form of media to make us afraid.. They will even outright lie to us and kill our own to make us believe and fear..

The world is doomed under western corporate capitalism.. Their greed will make everyone a slave eventually and destroy our planet..

[TSFantasia]

I'd have to disagree.. this guy was clearly mentally disturbed.. no sane individual would do this..

How did he become like that? Well that might be because of Wahhabiism.. and bad parenting..

The fact is that most of the attacks and mass shootings in north America are lone wolf crazies..

The Jihadists don't seem to be organized at all really.. that or they're just really stupid..

As for democracy.. do you really believe that even exists in the USA? Seriously?? It's a corrupted fascist oligarchy run by fake money..

I don't sympathize with the 2nd and 3rd world people using terror attacks against the west.. but I do see how through 2 centuries of oppression the west has made more than a few enemies.. People and cultures hold grudges for a long time..

Right now there are 10,000's of people dying every year in North America from illegal Chinese made pharmaceuticals.. Yet the USA & the west would rather fight it's war of terror so it can secure all the oil possible.. They sell the war to us on every form of media to make us afraid.. They will even outright lie to us and kill our own to make us believe and fear..

The world is doomed under western corporate capitalism.. Their greed will make everyone a slave eventually and destroy our planet..

I'm passing your name onto the FBI & Homeland Security!! Lol just kidding

I agree we really have little control over our destinies if it doesn't agree with Big Business Corporate America , International Bankers, etc. we are the little peons that just get swished around in the pond, while the absurdly rich decide what is an acceptable number of casualities versus profit margins. Companies do this all the time deciding whether to recall a product that they know is defective, unsafe and killing consumers or whether it is just cheaper to pay out a few successful law suits.

I don't think lone wolves can be passed off as crazies they are targeted and recruited by ISIS and other extremist groups via the internet to carry out terror attacks in the countries where they are nationalists. Yes they are delusional to believe the claims of ISIS promising of rewards for the martyrs of Islam. They are definitely isolated and disenfranchised individuals.

[Mouthwideopen]

I am no apologist if that is what you think. All of these acts are reprehensible.
Each response feeds the next cycle of violence. I don't have the answer and I don't think you do either. Blaming the religion and all of it's adherents for the acts of the radicals gains us nothing.
Mayor Nenshi of Calgary and Mullah Omar may share the same religion,but their ideologies are galaxies apart.

So in other words.. "not all". Lol.

If some coworker told me that "not all" germans wanted jews exterminated in gas ovens and that "not all" nazi's were ss executioners; I would give that coworker the following looks:







I feel like I've made this point a dozen times already in this thread. Take 5 mins out of your busy days and actually look at the poll #'s of various muslim majority countries ruled by varying sects. You would have to be blind or willfully intellectually dishonest to ignore the blatant hatred for women, lgbt's and apostates (amongst many other disturbing trends) in those countries. Go to post #43 of this thread and explore the stats for yourselves.

The doctrines and beliefs drawn from the different doctrines (fairy tales) actually does matter. There is a reason why one of these images gets nobody murdered, while the other leads to very predictable mass killings:








No Christians, Hindus, Jews or Buddhists chose to bomb or shot up the offices of the Onion when they published the first pic. In contrast I think we all know what happens when any newspaper depicts the blessed raping murderer Allah. Media outlets have zero hesitation in Canada or any other western nation about publishing cartoonish derogatory depictions of any "gods" .......except Allah of course.

Ignoring this double standard is ridiculous and harmful to the freedoms we now enjoy; despite how enslaved (lol) some of you may feel in this western system. What would Nenshi -(one of the best recent mayors in Canada despite his fairy tale muslim beliefs IMO)- think if a Charlie Hebdo styled cartoon were published in a Canadian paper? Does anyone actually think that there wouldn't be some sort of reaction?

I don't believe in any gods. This is a battle of ideas. I believe in the basic principles behind our freedoms. I believe that freedoms should win this battle not fear of reprisals, not people declaring "not all". As a civilization we have to move past fearing the actions of people (crazy or not-who cares) inspired by these barbaric ancient books (any of them) who fools think were written by "gods". If we don't face and overcome this ridiculous stance and these very obvious double standards....... what kind of future is there for humanity?

Or does no one really care? I for one believe that our society is better than theirs; that our beliefs, principles, freedoms and ideals lead to a better society than seen in any muslim majority country. The Jews had their dark times, Christians were killing people just a few centuries ago. Each religion seems to go through a sort of evolution. We need to enable the females, lgbt's and non-believers inside Muslim faith led countries to change their societies from within. Tip-toeing around the issues because we're afraid of offending people will not support this change anymore than declaring not all germans are Nazi's would have changed events and avoided millions of dead corpses in WWI and WWII.

EDIT: Even the first image of the "prophet" of the religion of peace (lol) that I posted for comparison on this forum was replaced by an image of a woman or ts face down in a red bikini... odd huh? Must have been a bad image link copied? Seems weird to me. I'll have to take pics next time I guess. Let's see if I have to change the pic yet again. Wonder if I'll get kicked off the forum for simply linking a pic that disagrees with some groups idea of "god".

2nd EDIT: 2nd linked pic of Allah seems to have stuck. Must have been a glitch. Perhaps I don't live in Canuckistan just yet.

3rd EDIT: Does anyone else think that a bumper sticker of the fabulous foursome would sell well?

[Shyla Wild]

talk to you in 3-4 months after the next shooting....Unlike your Fortune Telling skills, 3-4 months is statically the time between USA shootings.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-36742835


So...who wants to blame Terrorists, Religious fanatics or mental illness on this one? I'm sure they will find some reason. Who wants to blame American Culture? Because this stuff only happens in the USA. Shooting schools, nightclubs, office parties, shootouts on farms, planes flying into buildings, people blowing up marathons doesn't happen anywhere else in the world.

[Alexis]

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-36742835


So...who wants to blame Terrorists, Religious fanatics or mental illness on this one? I'm sure they will find some reason. Who wants to blame American Culture? Because this stuff only happens in the USA. Shooting schools, nightclubs, office parties, shootouts on farms, planes flying into buildings, people blowing up marathons doesn't happen anywhere else in the world.

I haven't got enough verifiable details to really say for sure but this is likely the fault of racism and the police protecting bad police..

Cops need to get rid of power trippers, bigots and other assholes in their midst and actually do their jobs..

Here in Canada the cops are a lot better, not perfect but a lot better.. Vancouver police are awesome compared to 25 years ago when they were crooked as hell.. The RCMP still has a lot of issues tho, particularly with racism against the indigenous community.. But they are working on it internally and getting rid of the racist officers..

I have the utmost respect for good cops.. They keep us safe, protect our kids and help our communities..

Bad cops and racist bigots should loose their jobs and not be allowed to do any type of law enforcement job..

[TSFantasia]

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-36742835


So...who wants to blame Terrorists, Religious fanatics or mental illness on this one? I'm sure they will find some reason. Who wants to blame American Culture? Because this stuff only happens in the USA. Shooting schools, nightclubs, office parties, shootouts on farms, planes flying into buildings, people blowing up marathons doesn't happen anywhere else in the world.

Yes addressing problems within American culture and yes better more restrictive gun controls is the answer to reducing these type of horrific incidents. Determining motive is always important in any violent crime or mass shooting. In the U.S. determines what agencies are involved in the investigation and what charges are laid. Heightening racial tensions seems the most likely motivation for this latest incident in response to the unprovoked police shootings of two Black men one in Minnesota and one in Louisiana.

But despite the frequency of these attacks in the U.S. for other than terrorist causes it's clear from recent attacks around the world that they can occur anywhere and that we have little real protection against anyone who decides to go on a killing spree if they get their hands on legal or illegal automatic weapons.

Anders Breivik shattered the normally peaceful lives of the people of Norway with his 2011 lone wolf attack, which left 77 dead and 319 injured.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_Norway_attacks

[alex99]

So...who wants to blame Terrorists, Religious fanatics or mental illness on this one? I'm sure they will find some reason. Who wants to blame American Culture? Because this stuff only happens in the USA. Shooting schools, nightclubs, office parties, shootouts on farms, planes flying into buildings, people blowing up marathons doesn't happen anywhere else in the world.

I personally blame fingers on the whole thing. If we had no fingers, this kind of stuff simply wouldn't happen.
On the other hand, we'd still have to contend with the opposable thumb, which is a logistical nightmare...

Btw, the sad thing about all this is that with every BLM terror campaign, the police are becoming even more militant, and I'm worried that we may eventually see a fascist police state emerge, which is when the real atrocities will begin. In the meantime, the cops will, as usual, stop showing up to the neighbourhoods where they're being shot at, and these places will become crime-ridden cesspools. Next thing you know, we've got walled-in cities where a new wave of roid monkey super cops protect what's left of the civilized world from the marauding rotten-toothed desert cannibals who reside in the desolate wastelands of America. I'm referring of course to Judge Dredd.

[Mouthwideopen]

I personally blame fingers on the whole thing. If we had no fingers, this kind of stuff simply wouldn't happen.
On the other hand, we'd still have to contend with the opposable thumb, which is a logistical nightmare...

Btw, the sad thing about all this is that with every BLM terror campaign, the police are becoming even more militant, and I'm worried that we may eventually see a fascist police state emerge, which is when the real atrocities will begin.

Exactly.

The shootings in Dallas have as much to do with Orlando as basketball has to do with golf. Both use balls... so what?
Ignore problem A (Islamic terrorism) - despite numerous bombings in Turkey, Iraq & Syria since Orland - let's only fixate on problem B. Got it.
Ban or restrict guns all you like and you will still have deadly mass shootings. Ignore this fact as much as you like. BTW Islamic terrorism happens all over the world- regardless of regional gun laws/bans.

Groups of people tend to self segregate regardless of idealistic concepts of everyone getting along - see Brampton -Richmond or any chinatown - any muslim neighbourhood. The only solution to ending this alleged racist police shooting issue is for these communities to self police. Is that the solution? Is the BLM / kkk advocated segregation really the solution?

If so, it would be very simple. Let the taxation collected in those communities fund their own homegrown police forces filled with people who are of that race or indigenous group.

Something tells me that society may not want that though because it may lead to us making conclusions we don't like or can't ignore.... and we won't have anyone to blame except the people who actually perform the criminal acts. It would remove a victimhood narrative ....the very thing that holds minorities back... we wouldn't really want that would we?

[alex99]

I don't like to talk about this, but my real concern is the zombie apocalypse that's coming.

[Shyla Wild]

Yes addressing problems within American culture and yes better more restrictive gun controls is the answer to reducing these type of horrific incidents. Determining motive is always important in any violent crime or mass shooting. In the U.S. determines what agencies are involved in the investigation and what charges are laid. Heightening racial tensions seems the most likely motivation for this latest incident in response to the unprovoked police shootings of two Black men one in Minnesota and one in Louisiana.

But despite the frequency of these attacks in the U.S. for other than terrorist causes it's clear from recent attacks around the world that they can occur anywhere and that we have little real protection against anyone who decides to go on a killing spree if they get their hands on legal or illegal automatic weapons.

Anders Breivik shattered the normally peaceful lives of the people of Norway with his 2011 lone wolf attack, which left 77 dead and 319 injured.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_Norway_attacks

Gun control would solve nothing in the USA. The Boston Marathon was bombed. It's not the guns. It's the mentality of these people.

In mature Countries like Norway or Japan this stuff works. When you have an immature population they will just find another way to kill each other.

With a bunch of household materials and some ball bearings you can basically make a bomb. Once you strap those ball bearings to a person with this Bomb, the instant that it detonates it will send those ball bearings in every direction ripping through an entire area in seconds.

Here is an example of the destruction it can cause.

Could you imagine some idiot setting off ones of these in a crowded area?