Orlando Massacre Shooter: Terrorist? Homophobe? Self-loathing Closeted Gay?

[Mouthwideopen]

I can agree to disagree ladies. I can only hope we'll have to settle our differing viewpoints aggressively & punishingly in a hotel room someday

I understand that Americans are a little crazy... I get that. They're gun nuts... I completely get that. I'm not here defending their gun culture. All I'm saying is that it's something that would literally take generations to change.

But when 130 people died in Paris from Muslim attacks we didn't blame French culture. When the Brussels airports and one metro station were bombed with 32 dead nobody blamed Belgian culture. Why do we blame guns when something like this happens in America?

From my perspective the biggest threat to the lives of anyone LGBT today anywhere in the world today is not Christian conservatives, the Amish or Baptists... its you know who. Denying that fact will not do anyone any favours or save any lives.

I've beaten this horse worse than..... uh never mind.

[Shyla Wild]

I can agree to disagree ladies. I can only hope we'll have to settle our differing viewpoints aggressively & punishingly in a hotel room someday

Anytime my love. A good discussion is always stimulating.

I understand that Americans are a little crazy... I get that. They're gun nuts... I completely get that. I'm not here defending their gun culture. All I'm saying is that it's something that would literally take generations to change.

I honestly think it goes beyond the guns. Like I said, Even if we ban the guns I really do just believe they will find another way to kill. That's the scary part and I do agree with you about this taking generations to change.

But when 130 people died in Paris from Muslim attacks we didn't blame French culture. When the Brussels airports and one metro station were bombed with 32 dead nobody blamed Belgian culture. Why do we blame guns when something like this happens in America?

Nor did we blame 911 on American Culture. Like I said, I just wonder why the USA had 1267% more mass shootings than anyone else?

From my perspective the biggest threat to the lives of anyone LGBT today anywhere in the world today is not Christian conservatives, the Amish or Baptists... its you know who. Denying that fact will not do anyone any favours or save any lives.

With time, acceptance, mutual respect....hopefully Humanity as a whole will find its way.

I've beaten this horse worse than..... uh never mind.

Ditto, I believe we have both made our points. No real need to continue.

[Alexis]

Another Mass Shooting..

Well.. There's been another mass shooting.. this time in a theater in Germany..

No one is going to blame this on gun control.. 25-50 people shot..

Guns are not the problem.. crazies and religion are the problem..

Correction.. The German police shot him dead before he could kill anyone.. and the initial report was inaccurate..

[unchained1]

I will tell you what I believe. I believe that a country that has a mass shooting every 3-4 months should take a hard look at itself. Does this happen anywhere else? No. You can spew anything you like here, play any angle. But this is the truth. Every few months, someone shoots out the place south of the border. And....it will blame everyone and anything except itself, it's culture and its society.

You are not alone. Here is a letter to the editor from today's Toronto Star.
" It is a pity and a shame that there is no inoculation for stupidity, ignorance, hatred borne of religion, homophobia and the hollow platitudes of Americans who claim the carnage of events such as Orlando and Sandy Hook Elementary School do not define them as a nation. On the contrary, it defines them with pathological precision."
Lest we be too smug, I have been following this discussion and one about the City of Toronto ad concerning racism on another forum. I'm appalled at the amount of hate, racism, and misinformation spewing forth from our fellow citizens.

[Mouthwideopen]

I'm appalled at the amount of hate, racism, and misinformation spewing forth from our fellow citizens.

Racism? How many times must this be pointed out? I would argue that if you can convert to it or renounce it and apostatize from it.... it is not a race. As for hate..... look up what the doctrine of Islam says about gays let alone women and non believers; now there is some top shelf hate.
Calling a spade a spade is not hate.

[Alexis]

Why single out Islam?

Racism? How many times must this be pointed out? I would argue that if you can convert to it or renounce it and apostatize from it.... it is not a race. As for hate..... look up what the doctrine of Islam says about gays let alone women and non believers; now there is some top shelf hate.
Calling a spade a spade is not hate.

Look up what the bible, the Torah and the Talmud say about it too while you're at it..

The Talmud is thew worst book of them all.. by far.. find an English copy and read it.. top shelf bigotry, racism and hatred..

Calling a spade a spade..

Have you even read from all the holy books of the various faiths? I've read lots in detail from all of the mentioned books..

The Talmud is by far the most wicked and vile book and goes into great detail how only Jewish people are people and the rest of us are animals or less.. How women are only property and cannot govern, etc, etc.. If a Jew kills a non Jew it's not murder.. If a Jew lies to a non Jew it's not a lie.. Seriously.. read it.. it's horrible and way worse than the bible which is worse than the Koran in my opinion..

You do realize there's more than one sect of Islam just like there's various sects of Judaism and Christianity? right??

You also do realize that all these idiots worship the same god right? the god of Abraham..

Islam's problem is Wahhabiism.. That's the sect that ISIL and the Saudis follow..

Religion should not be taught to children.. at least not any of the ones associated with Abraham.. That would help lots..

[alex99]

Bla bla bla people! :P

[unchained1]

Racism? How many times must this be pointed out? I would argue that if you can convert to it or renounce it and apostatize from it.... it is not a race. As for hate..... look up what the doctrine of Islam says about gays let alone women and non believers; now there is some top shelf hate.
Calling a spade a spade is not hate.

For your information I did not say Islam was a race.

[alex99]

For your information I did not say Islam was a race.

[Shyla Wild]

No God has ever asked anyone to worship him so man's desire to worship a deity is nothing more than an ego based need to make himself feel useful to a god who otherwise probably has no real use for anything man has to offer.

There is no evidence that whatever or whoever created us, needs us to worship them because the probability is that if we were created by a god or an advanced race, then they were doing it for their own purpose and agenda. Why would you worship someone just for carrying out their own agenda? Would an all powerful creator create a dysfunctional bunch of lemmings just for the purpose of worship? Why then give us intelligence, free choice, diversity, individuality and a strong will and then threaten to disown or terminate us as soon as we try to use them?

If a single true God does exist then creating a race of selfish, sinful, ignorant, arrogant, egotistical, money hungry and sex obsessed beings for the sole purpose of worshiping him would have to be the stupidest thing he's ever done.

Anyone trying to justify any religion being good remember a few things. 1/3 of Nazi Germany was Catholic, the other 2/3 Protestant...At what point is killing a few million Jews considered good? The Catholic Church wagged war in the name of God, etc,etc,etc.... Did God justify these acts? Did Jewish prophets speak to God before going to the Romans to kill Jesus? Even if they were right...what kind of God kills millions but has to get the Jews to get the Romans to kill him? Religion is a form of control, made to control simple people when it was created. Guess what? It still works today.

[Mouthwideopen]

I have been following this discussion and one about the City of Toronto ad concerning racism on another forum. I'm appalled at the amount of hate, racism, and misinformation spewing forth from our fellow citizens.

For your information I did not say Islam was a race.

Anyways.....

Alexis yes I know other texts are worse... the reason I don't care is because none of their believers are actively killing folks. Again... Polio or Cancer... what should we be more worried about? I've read all sorts of fairy tales and I don't care to read anymore. If some clown collective comes up with a new "god" tomorrow... I'm not going to read their book either. I don't see why my understanding of a nonsensical viewpoint needs exploring through reading any given indoctrination manual. I haven't read many books on leprosy either but I know enough to know I don't need or want it in my life.

I do realize that there are different sects of Islam... yet I simply don't care. It's majority muslim countries that are killing gays and stoning folks... countries in which you will find differing sects. of Islam. You may be able to educate me on this; is there a sect that denounces the Hadith? Is there a sect that denounces Sharia law?

I know everybody hates to generalize in this pc modern culture but the "not all" argument rings very very hollow when you look at the numbers in those Pew research polls.

Religion is nothing but a crutch for the weak, a shepherd for the sheep.
The sooner we thinking apes can rid of ourselves of every form of religions ... the sooner humanity will be able to put energy into real problems that face us instead of arguing over who's b.s. story is the "real" truth.

Not sure who to attribute this line to but I love it; "the surest sign of intelligent life out there in the universe is the fact that we haven't heard from them. Can't argue with that.

Religion is a form of control, made to control simple people when it was created. Guess what? It still works today.

And in the meantime....

[alex99]

...a race of selfish, sinful, ignorant, arrogant, egotistical, money hungry and sex obsessed beings...

You're preaching to the choir Shyla - in the end, the problem lies not within religion, but humanity itself, although sometimes we do good things, like creating that tv show Charmed. I'm still angry that Prue died though omg!

I can't believe that bitch quit the show!

[TSFantasia]

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Anyways.....

Alexis yes I know other texts are worse... the reason I don't care is because none of their believers are actively killing folks. Again... Polio or Cancer... what should we be more worried about? I've read all sorts of fairy tales and I don't care to read anymore. If some clown collective comes up with a new "god" tomorrow... I'm not going to read their book either. I don't see why my understanding of a nonsensical viewpoint needs exploring through reading any given indoctrination manual. I haven't read many books on leprosy either but I know enough to know I don't need or want it in my life.

I do realize that there are different sects of Islam... yet I simply don't care. It's majority muslim countries that are killing gays and stoning folks... countries in which you will find differing sects. of Islam. You may be able to educate me on this; is there a sect that denounces the Hadith? Is there a sect that denounces Sharia law?

I know everybody hates to generalize in this pc modern culture but the "not all" argument rings very very hollow when you look at the numbers in those Pew research polls.

Religion is nothing but a crutch for the weak, a shepherd for the sheep.
The sooner we thinking apes can rid of ourselves of every form of religions ... the sooner humanity will be able to put energy into real problems that face us instead of arguing over who's b.s. story is the "real" truth.

Not sure who to attribute this line to but I love it; "the surest sign of intelligent life out there in the universe is the fact that we haven't heard from them. Can't argue with that.


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And in the meantime....
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Religion has created more wars and hatred in human history than anything else. It has held back the scientific and social evolution of the human race for centuries condemning the progressive as heretics, blasphemers, and abominations. No they don't say "Kill them!", but just "They had it coming to them!" if someone else does! All for the delusion of eternal security and an insurance policy against the remotest possibility that a god exists, who though no one can prove the existence of or agree as to what "His Will" or plan is for mankind. This deity expects absolute faith and obedience or face eternal damnation. Yeah it's been a pretty effective control of the masses for centuries and sadly still in the 21st century no signs of mankind shedding this unnecessary and self destructive security blanket!

[Shyla Wild]

Religion has created more wars and hatred in human history than anything else. It has held back the scientific and social evolution of the human race for centuries condemning the progressive as heretics, blasphemers, and abominations. No they don't say "Kill them!", but just "They had it coming to them!" if someone else does! All for the delusion of eternal security and an insurance policy against the remotest possibility that a god exists, who though no one can prove the existence of or agree as to what "His Will" or plan is for mankind. This deity expects absolute faith and obedience or face eternal damnation. Yeah it's been a pretty effective control of the masses for centuries and sadly still in the 21st century no signs of mankind shedding this unnecessary and self destructive security blanket!

It must be the apocalypse....we actually agree on something.

You're preaching to the choir Shyla - in the end, the problem lies not within religion, but humanity itself, although sometimes we do good things, like creating that tv show Charmed. I'm still angry that Prue died though omg!

I can't believe that bitch quit the show!

I think I pee'd myself a little reading that...

[unchained1]

Well said Fantasia. I couldn't agree more.

On on another relevant matter: I write in a concise style for various reasons. Perhaps the nuance and intended meaning is not conveyed. My apologies.
HOWEVER:
By affixing derogatory labels to people rather than asking for clarity, as He Whose Handle Was So Appropriately Chosen has done, only defines them and certainly does not advance the dialogue in this discussion.