Is it next to IMPOSSIBLE to have a Tgirl relationship ???

[sensual_lover20]

Not trying to make waves but, I don't find that comment to be a comfortable one. Makes no sense to me.

I don't think the " having money " thing plays here.

What is not to make sense. If you could meet some of Tia's, Lucy's or Lisa's high end clients it may make some sense. They do not want to associate their status with t-girls. It is an unfortunate reality but it is true. Before you go off, THERE ARE EXCEPTIONS!!!

The only point I am trying to make is that if you took a look at ALL TORONTO t-girls, a selected few would have boyfriends with lots of money. There are several reasons why, one is stated above. Not that I have been around a long time, but I have definitely seen a lot. I can say that the large majority of them are just looking for someone who accepts them for who they are and one that they connect with on a level higher than physical (obvious some physical attraction is required). The first draw though is physical of course, but this is inherently obvious. Both genetic and t-girls will often joke they did for gold, but few realize that dream.

If you can refute this (assuming my logic makes sense here without re-reading it), then I humbly bow to you.

Even TesticuLarry agreed with me.

Perhaps I phrased it wrong in the first place, but this should clear things up.

[pioneer20]

Wow, it's like I just opened up a fresh can of worms...anyways, that was exactly my point...general social opinion is that a relationship with a t-girl is not orthodox, well then neither is sex before marriage.

You get tons of people who are would like to be in a relationship with one, or at least the thought of it, but are embarrassed to be seen in public with them; that won't go nowhere.

Then you get guys who are honest and genuine about it and don't care what others think, I always believed that a true friend will be happy for you no matter what; with that being said, those who don't think that having a relationship with a t-girl is right are not being forced into it and don't have to do it. From what I see is that a lot of girls don't even bother to find out whether the guy is being true to them or not, most just assume (possibly from previous experiences and/or hearsay) that all they are out to get is physical / sexual gratification. If they give a guy a chance they might find out differently.

[Haley]

There definitely seems to be two types of guys here. Those who see t-girls as women, and are therefore willing to be seen with t-girls, and those who see t-girls as "dirty little secrets".

Bravo to the men who see us as women.

As for the guys who like to hide, think about this.

If you hadn't been told the girl you find attractive was a t-girl, would you have known?

The fact is, many of us girls pass very well, and can go through life without any problems, which also means, our boyfriends won't have problems.

For example, I used to do a lot of modeling in print and runway (as a woman of course) and I've even appeared in national ad campaigns for Eatons, (back when there still was an Eatons) and nobody knew I was trans. I was also voted the "2004, Girl of the Year" in an international calendar girl contest with over 18 000 people voting for me, and they didn’t know I was trans! I've also had work in TV and film. I've had auditions for Battlestar Galactica, Supernatural, The L-Word, and I've worked on Catwoman, Fantastic Four, The Collector, Dead Like Me, and even the Gwen Arajuo TV movie, and no one ever questioned my sex in any of these productions. In fact, I've met other t-girls who had no idea I had a trans history. Now knowing this, would you still not want to be seen with me?

If so, then the problem isn't with me. It's with you. It's your own paranoia or guilt, which keeps you hiding, so the only person to blame for not being able to have a relationship with a t-girl is you. If you can't get past the "t" in t-girl, you will out yourself every time, and believe me, most of us girls don't want to be with a guy who constantly brings up the trans part.

I’m not trying to give you guy’s hell. I’m just trying to give you guys a perspective, which might allow you to pursue something that could make you very happy for a very long time. Life is too short to deny yourself those things that make you happy.

[TesticuLarry]

.

If you hadn't been told the girl you find attractive was a t-girl, would you have known?

The fact is, many of us girls pass very well, and can go through life without any problems, which also means, our boyfriends won't have problems.

There are those that pass very well given the benefit of selective camera angles and creative, liberal photoshop, and while there are big genetic women, many T-girls pushing 6'3" 225 pounds and better, aren't fooling anyone.
Also, the falsetto voice and "feminine", cutesy lisp that many try to effect to feminize their masculine voices shouldn't be able to really fool anyone but the dim of wit.

Chances are that unless a man that is openly having a relationship with a T-girl couldn't care less as to what anyone around him thinks, astute observors in the room will know exactly what he has on his arm if they're closer than 100 yards away.

[shemale_patriciaM]

This guy should remain in the closet forever....and keep paying tgirls because you're nothing but a "paying client" and that's exactly where you belong. Have fun inside the closet, i am sure Tom Cruise will keep you company forever.

[pioneer20]

I'd have to agree with both. Some are very passable, and no one can tell the difference, others aren't. However, if you're in a relationship should you really care? Some of my friends wouldn't be too fond of the idea, and I won't be running around screaming that my gf is a trans...those who ask will know, otherwise why should the topic ever come up. To me, if I'm dating her, it's a girl...to anyone else I could care less.

What I find really funny is that some TG's are actually way better looking then a lot of GG's...go figure, remind me again why they are looked at differently??

[Iugula]

I personally don't think it's possible. But, then again, it maybe me.

I have been away for weekends with at least 3 - 4 tgirls. I have treated them as equals and as I would any girl that I was dating. With total respect - opening the door, politeness, openness, and affection. This was the way I was brought up.

I was totally at peace and comfortable with my companions. We moved in public together exactly as I always did with my ex-wife and all the genetic girls that I have dated.

But somewhere between here and there nothing ever transpired. There was always an issue.

Lets face it, I am interested in the genetalia of tgirls. Just as I have been interested in the genetalia of the many genetic girls I dated. It's all part of the package. I love sex and I'm a very sexual person.

But I also enjoy intelligence, a sense of humour, romance, chatting. Because, the horizontal boogie can't last forever. These other things then come into play and are important.

Would I settle down with the right tgirl? Yes. Would I marry them? Yes. Would I embrace them into my life and share with them yes.

BUT. BUT. BUT.

I have found the tgirls that I have spent time with to be far more judgmental and interested in the superficialities of life than any genetic girl that I have ever dated.

So, I've given up. In fact I won't even see any tgirls here in Toronto any more on any basis.

Just my personal experiences.

As I said at the start maybe it's me.

Maybe one day some really special princess tgirl will swoop into my life and capture my heart. Would be nice, would be splendid. But I'm not holding my breath.

[prettyboy]

Well put, I feel a real kinship to your experiences and conclusions.

[TesticuLarry]

This guy should remain in the closet forever....and keep paying tgirls because you're nothing but a "paying client" and that's exactly where you belong. Have fun inside the closet, i am sure Tom Cruise will keep you company forever.

It may just be nothing more than a simple case of sanity prevailing when I step into my closet. An instant reality check mechanism. Anytime you harbor the urge to remove the rose colored lenses and see the world as it really is, you're welcome to stop by, visit my closet, and see what the world really looks like with unfettered vision.

What you aren't considering is that although passable T-girls are women in appearance, technically, any type of a man to man sexusl relationship falls under the general category of homosexuality to the mainstram general public. You can't get away from this by wishing that thought away like Billy Mumy in Twilight Zone.

In the 21st century, man/man sexual partnerships are far more public than 50 years ago, but still, for every individual that sees an event of two men getting married and thinks, "Whillikers! Aren't they a cute couple. How happy I am for them!", there are 10 who may be saying the same thing, but thinking, "Look at these two fucking reparbates...Disgusting!".

Unfortunately, you can't reprogram the way people think. You'd have to start by banning the Bible, the most read book in the world, which is overtly anti- same sex unions.

These are the type of observations you make when you're in my reality closet! Doesn't mean you have to like them or think the same way. In my closet, you simply see these points clearly.

[shemale_patriciaM]

One word...miserable!

[TesticuLarry]

One word...miserable!

Miserable? I suppose the truth about the way things are, and having to come to terms with it sometimes is. Unless you're not of this Earth and a citizen of Cloud Nine.



You envision a world where same sex relationships are universally embraced by the general population at large. Where the public en masse' will openly applaud a man married to a T-Girl, or a man married to another man, which is technically the same thing, like it or not, regardless if he's the schmuck next door or the President of the United States.

In reality, this type of general, open arms acceptance, though a wonderful fantasy on paper, is a pipe-dream in practice.

[dan_calgary]

What I find really funny is that some TG's are actually way better looking then a lot of GG's...go figure,

Ain't that the truth,

I will say a majority of t-girls will pay more attention to the way they look then your gg's. It's amazing to me how many gg's could care less how they look when they are out in the public eye,

[pioneer20]

What you are saying is true, but to a degree. It all goes back to how much a person cares about what others think. If you are truly happy with a t-girl, would you be willing to throw away that happiness in order to avoid some other person's remark? In that case you're basically giving up something that brings you joy (the relationship) in order to satisfy someone else, but are you really satisfying them? I could certainly say that it won't make even the tiniest bit of an impact on someone else's life, however it will have a great impact on your own...that said, where's the sense in that?

i.e. If I go to bar with a couple of my buddies after working on my car I usually don't bother changing, and after a while they all got the point that I'm not out to impress anyone with fancy cloths. If someone doesn't like it they don't have to look; personally I don't find it convenient to go and pretty up to go for a beer with a bunch of guys, regardless of what others may think. Some people will spend hours trying to look all spiffy for a beer meet, it all depends on how you react and respond to others' comments, and opinion.

[TesticuLarry]

If you are truly happy with a t-girl, would you be willing to throw away that happiness in order to avoid some other person's remark?

Let's try to put the acceptance scenario into a practical application.

Say a cop, whose held in high esteem by his colleagues, decides to go way out on a limb and bring his T-girlfriend to the next Police Benovalent Association function at the local Dunkin' Donuts.

He strides in proudly, arm in arm, with his T-Girlfriend and orders a jelly donut for him, and a French Crueller for his GF. By the time the donuts hit the counter, half of his buddies immediately are cognizant of the fact that this is a she-male. Some, even recognize her, possibly from being her client themselves, at some time in the past or even present, and possibly one or more of his buddies work vice and have arrested her at some time. Within 10 minutes, the entire room is buzzing.

Now, his associates that are roaring heterosexuals, will be aghast at the prospect that their buddy, the man they fight crime with, shoulder to shoulder, is probably having his rump rustled on a daily basis, and will now hold him in disdain, rather than respect.

How do you think this is going to affect the way his comrades, that his very life depends on, now envision him? Like Serpico's comrades did?

The man will be ostracized not only behind his back, but openly I'll wager, dildos and flowers left in front of his locker daily!

This type of unenviable position will be created for any professional in a position of trust and respect. Doctors, lawyers, Indian chiefs, anyone whose profession is dependant upon his peers, higher ups, and clients, or those they serve, holding them in impeccably high regard.

[Salvador]

! I've also had work in TV and film. I've had auditions for Battlestar Galactica, Supernatural, The L-Word, and I've worked on Catwoman, Fantastic Four, The Collector, Dead Like Me, and even the Gwen Arajuo TV movie, and no one ever questioned my sex in any of these productions. In fact, I've met other t-girls who had no idea I had a trans history. Now knowing this, would you still not want to be seen with me?

If so, then the problem isn't with me. It's with you. It's your own paranoia or guilt, which keeps you hiding, so the only person to blame for not being able to have a relationship with a t-girl is you. If you can't get past the "t" in t-girl, you will out yourself every time, and believe me, most of us girls don't want to be with a guy who constantly brings up the trans part.

I'm a little confused here. I haven't noticed a big number of guys here having a serious problem with the idea of dating a , ( as you put it ) " t- girl " in public.

Raise your hand if any of you guys have a problem with that.

Not me !

I'm just turned off by the escorting stuff etc. . .
I just don't want to get involved with a woman who does tricks for a living.

You wouldn't happen to know any besides you that don't would ya Haley ?